Navigating Your Own Crisis or Grief While Supporting Others with Leanne Schultz

“HR is the cone of silence…you take the weight of a lot of people’s emotions.”

“When you are in a space in your own life, when things are piling up, as an HR professional who is perceived to have all the answers, where can  you go?”
-Leanne Schultz

Have you had to deal with grief or personal crisis  while still working and while people are still looking to you for support with their own tough situations?   Today’s guest and I discuss how she is navigating her mom’s terminal illness while still supporting the employees depending on her.  

My guest is Leanne Schultz. Leanne Schultz, CPHR, has worked in Human Resources for over 10 years in the K-12 education industry. She is currently the Director of Human Resources at West Point Grey Academy, an independent school located in Vancouver BC.

An avid believer in connection and sharing perspectives, Leanne spends a great deal of her time listening and asking questions. Gaining an understanding of the culture helps her to shape the systems and strategies in schools that allow education staff to be their best to help kids do their best.

Leanne and her family split their time between Vancouver and Vancouver Island.

In this episode of Talent Management Truths, you’ll discover:

• Thoughts around how to take care of yourself so that you can support others
• The power of sharing what is really going on in your life - at work
• How important it is to skip the “suck it up buttercup” mentality and learn how to actively grieve

Links

• Leanne Schultz on Linkedin: www.linkedin.com/in/leanne-schultz-cphr-58217877
• Book: Grief One Day at a TIme: 365 Meditations to Help You Heal After Loss by Alan Wolfelt

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Transcript

LM Ep 107

 [00:00:00] Have you ever had to deal with grief or personal crisis while still working and while people are still looking to you for support as their HR partner? Well, today's guest and I discuss how she's navigating her mom's terminal [00:01:00] illness, all while still supporting the employees who depend on her. My guest is Leanne Schultz.

Leanne's worked in HR for over 10 years in the K to 12 education industry. She's currently director of HR at West Point Gray Academy, an independent school located in Vancouver, bc. In this episode of Talent Management Truce, you'll discover thoughts around how to take care of yourself so that you can support others.

The power of sharing what's really going on in your life. At work and how important it's to skip the, suck it up buttercup mentality and learn how to actively grieve. I hope you get some meaningful takeaways from this episode. Leanne is really open in sharing her experience and I share a little bit about wine as well.

Enjoy.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: hello and welcome back to Talent Management Truce. I'm your host, Lisa Mitchell, and today I'm joined by Leanne Schultz. Leanne is director of HR at West Point [00:02:00] Gray Academy in British Columbia. Welcome to the show, Leanne.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Oh, thank you so much for having me, Lisa. I.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: So let's kick off by having you share a little bit about your career path, because I really enjoyed hearing about it when we first got to know each other.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Oh, thank you. Well, I think, or I've been told that my career path into human resources is a little unusual in that I started in my industry and then sought more learning and a designation in human resources so I could better service my industry. And I know if that's not. Entirely unusual, but it's certainly given me a bit of a unique perspective, especially within the independent school realm.

I guess what I could say is that I started out as an executive assistant to the head of my school at the time, and this was about 13, 14 years ago. Oh my gosh, time is going.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Okay. Yep.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Prior to that, you know, I'd explored different, different careers and [00:03:00] different interests and took some time off to be the chief domestic engineer of the Schultz Corporation for a few years.

But when I came back into the workforce, I, I just kind of threw myself into it with gusto and. Really was amazed when I was asked to take on the, the human resources role, but recognized that this isn't something that you do off the side of the desk. I needed an element of professional learning, so I went to, royal Rhodes University and got a graduate certificate in Strategic HR Management, which was an incredible, incredible program. And after that wrote my, at the time was the chirp, so now it's the CHRP, I believe.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Or 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: CPHR. Yeah. wRote the exam and, and became a, a certified HR professional which was, was really amazing and I was able to then.

[00:04:00] Really use the background and operational knowledge I had of the school to really leverage my HR practice. And they just, they fit together so, so beautifully. That I think my approach is a little bit unusual or unorthodox sometimes in schools because in the independent school system. Human resources was traditionally done by the head of school and the heads of schools, again, traditionally were people who were trained as teachers and who had worked their way up and had a gift and a talent for administration.

But. I really was expected to know everything, and I, I still get a bit of a giggle to this day because, you know, people who are trained as teachers don't necessarily know how to run the finances or the operations of, of what for some of these schools or multimillion dollar organizations with, with [00:05:00] hundreds of employees.

So I would say within the last decade or so. There's been a real recognition for the value and the need for human resources within independent schools, and I think those of us who, who really have an operational background and who are able to apply a sense of context for the practice of human resources are really helping to really bring these schools forward.

As I would just say, amazing places to work and employees of choice. Yeah.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yeah, so I really hear this, this, you know, marriage of operational experience with, with the HR expertise. And that's, that's something that I'm constantly preaching about, you know, with my, with my private clients around. I. You know, from a talent management, HR perspective is you've got to know the business and you've got to earn that credibility to be at the table with the people that you serve, with your, with your, your stakeholders.

So I, I think it's interesting the path that you took to get there, you [00:06:00] know, and as far as teachers being administrators, I mean, I'm sure some of them were excellent and some of them struggle with it. I, I don't know. I, I was a teacher myself. I don't know if you knew that 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: I did know that actually. Yes.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Going way, way back. And it's interesting 'cause at the time I remember I, I only did it for a couple years and I came out, I thought, who's gonna want me?

And, and, you know, was trained in a very specific thing and didn't, was not interested in finances. Like my ex-husband, kudos to him. He did all the finances and the stuff at the house. Now I do it in

our, in our. My current household, but it, you know, it took a long time. 'cause part of it was, was mindset and opening up to deciding, hey, I can learn this if I need to.

But it's just interesting 'cause it's sort of like what you did. You're like, oh, this is an opportunity. Well I'm gonna get some of that more formal background to back me up and, and give me additional expertise. So, so tell us a little bit about, so, so West Point Gray Academy, so it's an independent school, is that the same as private school?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah, there, there's a few different [00:07:00] distinctions and every province has this little areas of classification. So. In British Columbia, we've got primarily independent schools and we've actually got a few different types of independent schools. So we've got religious-based independent schools.

We have first Nations run independent schools. We have specialty program independent schools like Waldorf from Montessori. And then we have schools like West Point Gray Academy, and I think there's about 37 of them in British Columbia. Mostly focused in the lower mainland. And we offer the same curriculum as the public schools the same K to 12 curriculum.

And we're actually inspected and monitored by the BC Ministry of Education and then. We are also accredited by an association called case, which is stands for CAIS, the Canadian Association of Independent Schools. And [00:08:00] it has a very, very rigorous accreditation process that schools within its membership must follow and it has schools all across Canada as part of its membership.

And we're actually undergoing an accreditation visit in a few short weeks. So we, you know, as part of that, we do a very intense year long self-study self-reflection, and you know, in addition to making sure that all of our regulatory compliance and policies are in place, they, they just wanna get a sense of how we're functioning.

As a school and it, it, it always makes me giggle because there's this, I guess there's this praise of independence. Every school is unique and, and I would say that has something different to offer and there's a good fit for every kid. You know, no matter what they're looking for, if they're sports inclined or if they're, you know, you know, artistic or if they wanna focus on the humanities or even, you know, we have schools that [00:09:00] specialize in supporting kids.

Specifically with learning differences. There's one school in Vancouver that supports kids with autism, others with dyslexia. Like there's something for everybody.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: a range of like that 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: yeah, yeah. yeah. So.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: is important. So like when it comes to supporting a school like that from an HR perspective, could you paint a picture for us? Like how many kids are there, how many staff, and what does your sort of portfolio look like if you would?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Well, my portfolio is massive, so I'll, I'll get to that. But we've got at West Point Gray Academy, we've got just over 980 students. anD we've got. About 200 staff. So one of the things that really distinguishes independent schools is our ability to offer fairly low staff to student ratios. so this means that I support the 200 staff to do their [00:10:00] job to support these 980 kids.

The majority of our staff are certified teachers. That's another requirement of independent schools and BC is that teachers have to be certified. And. They really run the gamut. Like, you know, you talk about, you talk about, you know, the starting stage, first job in the career or been at the school the whole time.

Age ranges, gender, like I, I've, I've got it all. And then I do have a small cohort of non-faculty. So these people support the business operations of the school. I've got a, a business center run under a director of finance. I've got, oh my gosh, I've got an enrollment, fundraising advancement.

 We're kind of like our own little school district. To be honest. So when with those staff you know, again, you've got the mix of folks who, who maybe are in on a, a manual labor position who, who [00:11:00] have a high school graduation diploma to people who are very, very highly educated and, and, you know, certified accountants or other professionals.

Yeah. It's a real rage. So.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: think about, like a lot of my listeners are, are more corporate hr for some really massive organizations. Some are one person departments. It really varies. Some are in, in education. You know, how are you supporting these, the, the teachers and the non-faculty? Like is, are there, are there various learning programs that you put them through?

You're supporting professional development in some way, like beyond, you know, there's the keep the lights on hr, so I'm sure payroll benefits, that kind of good stuff is, is part and parcel, but what, what, what, what does that look like for you?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: It's, it's actually really amazing because I am almost, well, I'm a 1.5 person HR department, so I have a a payroll and benefits specialist whose, whose name is Lynn. And I call her the right side of my brain. She, she does all the calculations and make sure that we're compliant and I get to do the rest.

[00:12:00] So really it. It really ranges. My day totally ranges from dealing with the small things to the strategic pieces and having a seat at the leadership table. But in terms of trying to service such a wide clientele, I think I just have to pull in on my operational knowledge of how these schools work because.

I know what the rules are and what they require in a school. My parents were teachers. So I have a fundamental sympathy and understanding of what the job entails. And, and I think as long as people are seen and they're recognized and they're valued for the work that they do, then they'll come alongside you to make sure that they're fulfilling the obligations of the job, so to speak.

So, you know, for some people that I work with, it's, it's their first job. So, you know, the discussions that I have with them [00:13:00] are, are very basic. Like, this is what your benefits package is and here's what it entails. Here's why you need to sign up for your group RSP program.

Here's what compound interest means. essentially here's how to add adult 1 0 1. Versus the other end of the spectrum. I've got teachers who are, you know, at retirement age and they're wondering, okay, well how do I wind down this amazing career that I've had? How do I share my knowledge? How do I, you know, get in touch with somebody who can help me prepare for, for my financial future?

And it's really fun. Like no two days ev ever the same.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: So it sounds like it's a lot of kind of employee relations versus kind of formal, you know, programmatic sort of strategy work that you're doing. Like it's really meeting people where. They're at amongst this diverse group.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah, it's, it, it really is half and half. I, I, I feel like, as long as the processes and the frameworks are in place, then you can fall back on those. But I would say about 30, 25 to [00:14:00] 30% of my job is making sure that the, the policy and the process framework is, is rigorous enough to support my staff. And then the other 75% of my role is purely relational.

And I, I really think that's the success of the school. I guess the school culture impacting my practice because when you're in a school, everybody's got the good feels and the best intentions and the growth mindset and, you know, believing the best of everybody and, and trying to get them to achieve their potential.

So I. You know, I, I feel like the people that I'm able to hire and bring on who are a good fit for our school, they've kind of, you know, drunk the Kool-Aid. So it makes my job just that little bit easier to bring them along.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: is so great to hear too, just that there's this natural growth mindset amongst people that are attracted to the, to the profession. You know, some people. Would [00:15:00] argue that that's not the case. That there's some people that shouldn't be teaching anymore, and I'm sure that's, you know, pockets of that.

When I was a, a teacher and I'm tr I think it was on one of my teaching blocks, so this is 30 years ago. I mean, we were putting. Kids through the multiple intelligences program. I don't know if you, if you,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: wow.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: and so this is around, you know, it's not, are you smart, but how are you smart? And I remember going, this is like, this is, I, where was this when I was growing up?

When my brother struggled, you know, was growing up. Like honestly you know, it was, it was so, it was more about. Seeing potential versus, versus issues in that growth mindset was very, very much, oh God. Anyways, I, I just think it's interesting that, you know, today you're talking about that and you see that you're living that.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Well, and, and it gives me a wider flexibility, I think, when it comes to recruitment because, you know, I get to focus more on potential than I, I wouldn't say more, but I would say as equally on [00:16:00] potential or what I see as potential and capacity as opposed to technical skill. I mean, which isn't to say that skill isn't valued, especially if we're looking at, at highly skilled.

Positions. I mean, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna look for a director of finance who, who doesn't have a designation or who's proven themselves. But, I, I, I'm so intimately connected with the culture of the school that I can, I can say. I think, I think you'd adapt well, I think we could throw you into this crazy little environment and you'll thrive and I can support you in, in succeeding and it's gonna be relatively easy because you've already got the aptitude and, and the soft skills to, to succeed in this environment.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: I think that's really, really important. I've worked a lot in talent acquisition over my career and led in the area and I, you know, it's, it's so clear that we hire for expertise, right, and [00:17:00] skill, and yet we often fire when the fit proves not to be right or people

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: in the, in the sandbox no matter how knowledgeable or skillful they are, right?

It that in the end, that's the stuff that matters. It's back to that. You know, even just like the way you allocate your time, you know, 75% against relationships. Like what if we all were able to do that and, and did do that, right.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: It's such a luxury. I'm, I'm very well aware that I've, I've got a luxury to be here and when we do the recruiting, we say we recruit for talent, but we hire for fit.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yeah,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: absolutely. Okay, well, so let's, let's take a bit of a. I left turn, um, because you, you shared with me that, you know, you've got some, some big stuff happening in your personal life

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Mm-Hmm.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: raises the question of. How do you keep your cup filled? How do you ensure that you're well [00:18:00] supported, such that you can take care of the people relying on you?

So in, in hr, in learning this, this is a thing. You know, I, I actually, during, during the pandemic, uh uh. A friend of mine, close friend of mine, who's also a coach, we ran these forums for other coaches and it was called, they were just free courageous coaches. And the whole piece of it was, was, you know, kind of helping ourselves, but helping our community sort of say, what do we need?

Because we had clients going through really rough stuff and we were going through rough stuff. So we were figuring out like, how can we show up and truly be present? So, you know, I think this is a really important topic. You know, it was just Mental Health Day. We're recording in October, which is national Mental Health Day a couple days ago.

And, and you know, this is an important question. So would you be willing to share a little bit about what you're going through and what you've observed? What, what you're noticing?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah. Yeah. No, I'd be happy to And and thanks for the opportunity because I think this is [00:19:00] a really valuable conversation. I think that human resources we're, we're often the cone of silence. And it's, it's a job that sometimes necessarily is, is done in isolation. You're, you're holding confidences and you take the weight of a lot of people's emotions and, and the really big feelings.

And your job is to listen and to hold that and to, I guess just be, humble in the trust that that people give you. But I think conversely, it takes a lot of energy to be really present when people are in crisis and when they're in need. And I think, I often joke that one of the things that I think helps me in my practice is that I'm very good at compartmentalization.

I can just put things in boxes and, and. I can be stoic when I need to, and pragmatic when I need to, and you know, just help out with a crisis. But [00:20:00] things, things add up and, and you can't be like that all the time. And when you are in a space in your own life, when, when things are piling up as an HR professional who's supposed to.

You know, or is perceived to have all the answers and be everything for everybody, where can you go? So I was, I was explaining to you earlier, Lisa, that my mom received a terminal diagnosis earlier this year, and she is progressing towards the end of her life, which is. It's scary. Nobody wants to lose their mommy.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: No, they do not.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: No, they do not. And then on top of that, you know, being the mother of two dynamic, amazing teenage girls who are exactly where they should be in their development right now, which is I. veRy self-centered and self-focused. And, and, you know, my role I see as a parent at this point is to provide that unconditional love and support.

And [00:21:00] even though it's, it's very hard sometimes. And then, you know, being a good spouse, being a good employee, being a good friend. It's all, it's all like withdrawal strips of your own little personal bank, right? It kind of chips away at you. So how, how do you try and manage all of that to show up to the people who count on you to be the.

The person who solves the problems, who has the friendly ear, who can listen in a non-judgmental way and offer solutions 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: it, well, another guest. Just recently though, was another guest was talking a bit about, you know, it is that idea of who takes care of us. I call it the Shoemakers Children's Syndrome. I've written about it and about it

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: it.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: you know, and so that's why I. I do. The work I do is it's 'cause I wanna support people in this space having been on the other side.

Right? [00:22:00] And so that, because their impact on everybody else, it's this domino effect. There's this ripple effect. I call, I call people in our area multipliers, right? If you are taking care of yourself. Even as you're going through some of the same issues that the people are looking to you for help with you know, just imagine what that can do to lift people up Right on mass.

So, so let's talk a bit about this. So, so we've, you've painted this picture of, you know, you're this adult daughter,

don't wanna lose your mom and I. I hear you. Having lost my dad in 2020, I was, it brought me to my knees, to be honest with you. He lived with me. We were very close. You've got the two teens.

I, but the one teen, you're a leader, you're an employee, you're a friend, you're a spouse, so you're juggling, you know, a lot of hats on that one head. how do you put fuel in your tank? What, what are, what's, What are your thoughts around what's working or not working for you right now?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: I think, [00:23:00] you know, the first, the first thing really is to, to build that network. And, and actually one of the first things I did when I got in here was I upgraded our employee family assistance program. So, 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yeah, timely.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: yeah, very, so this is, this is, you know, a few years ago when I first started in this role at this particular school, and, knowing that, you know, I, I wanted to have something really strong in place for my staff, especially coming out of the pandemic. We were seeing a lot of, a lot of burnout within the teaching profession and, and just within the education sector as a whole, along with other, you know, service type sectors.

So I, I, I really wanted to improve that and I'm grateful that I did because now I'm the beneficiary of an amazing counselor who I've secured through the EFAP program. The other thing that I've found really helpful is. And I'm always really cognizant of the boundary between, you know, am I oversharing or am I just normalizing by saying things out [00:24:00] loud?

And I, I'm, I'm just so fortunate to have such amazing friends and incredible colleagues who are sympathetic and who are understanding, and I, I am able to have the flexibility. And, and with my boss especially, who says, you know, whatever you need to do, let's do it. He, he's built a culture of lead with Yes.

Which I can't appreciate enough. Like it's, it's incredible. And. try to help embody that culture as well, which is, you know, at the end of the day, we're all adults. I'm gonna trust you until I have a reason not to. So, if you tell me that you need to have some support with your work life bloom, and to be at home to help take care of a parent, but keep an eye on some of the things, or work on a task to decide, then that's okay.

Like whatever you need to do.[00:25:00] So essentially I, I really try to be mindful about practicing the same self-care and compassion that I preach amongst my staff. And sometimes it's hard because it's you know, I still can't let go of that. Overachieving be everything for everybody. And when you're in a position of high, I would say of, a high profile position such as my own people notice and, and maybe it's because I'm really expressive and usually I'm pretty ju, but people, people say, are you okay, Liam? What's going on today? Like, if, if, if I'm just that little bit off people notice,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Oh, absolutely. We, I think we all give off more clues than we, than we realize, especially, you know, 'cause it's, it's, this is emotions are energetic.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: They, they really, really are. And, and I've, I've just made a very conscious decision. Are you okay instead of the natural? Oh, I'm fine. Thanks for asking. I don't mind saying, actually, it's been a really rough weekend for me. I've [00:26:00] had to make this really big, you know, help my dad make this really big decision and, our family dynamic is gonna change, and I'm still kind of processing it, and then we'll have a little short conversation.

But I feel better having shared it, and I would like to think that, you know, if more of us were able to have these authentic conversations, then maybe we wouldn't be keeping as much up inside, you know?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Well, it's interesting you say that 'cause I, 'cause, 'cause what was going through my mind as you were, as you were talking about this, like, you know. Giving this example of being vulnerable and being open and sharing some of the, the crap you're going through because tears come up, you know, with this kind of stuff, it's

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: They do?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: very emotional time of life really.

with juggling, you know, being that sandwich generation, so this, this vulnerability. But if I think about when my mom died, I, my baby was 10 months old

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Oh,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: and I was on mat leave and she was sick. My whole mat leave, so it wasn't a mat leave. I had

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: No. Oh, and do you, did you feel robbed a little [00:27:00] bit

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: I, I did, and well, yes and no.

Actually, I don't really.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: and, and not in a bad way, but 

just in 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: here's why. Like I still got to Mother Goose and made all these great friends and learned n you know, nursing rhymes and, and did some of that. But, but it, it was a tough year and, but I am so grateful that because I had this big job that I was off and had the flexibility to do the appointments and deal with the hospitals in and out and all that jazz and take care of my dad and anyway.

So, but at the time, almost, so three months later I went back to work. So now I have a baby. I'm bereft, I've lost my mom. 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Oh 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: very close and I don't have, you know, can I help my in-laws live far away and. And, uh, you know, I was in a, I was in a great, a great company with a great culture, but you know, again, this is, this is going back 16 years now, and so it wasn't quite, you know, what we're talking about.

I, I did leverage AP and some counseling and so on, but I, I think [00:28:00] I sort of sort of like suck it up buttercup, which is

what listeners are probably nodding their heads right now

going, oh, because, 'cause if you're of a certain age, a lot of us sort of came up that way. There was some like, you gotta pay your dues, you gotta.

Have a straight face. You've gotta compartmentalize and check that part of yourself at the door. I do not believe in that at all because we, when I went through that piece with my mom, when I'd gone through a divorce, the emotions would sneak up on me if I wasn't taking care of myself when I least wanted them to, like, at work in the middle of a meeting, you know, this kind of thing.

So, so we've gotta give ourselves the space and the grace to, to process. So, I, I, I'm really appreciative that you're sharing this example because some of the things that come up for me, I mean that you've mentioned, that are kind of on my list of self-care. It's, if I think about losing my dad three years ago, I actually really learned how to grieve properly compared to when my mom died because I ensured I had counseling.

I also had a [00:29:00] coach. I talked a lot with supportive friends, a lot of whom are coaches, which was helpful, right. I had a really great community. I gave myself lots of space.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Mm-Hmm.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Now I'm self-employed, so I was able to take, I. And did take three months off just to deal with the estate and the grief piece. I still had a couple of clients, but here and there, but I, they would, it would be like one meeting, you know, every three days or something.

And I would do a lot of prep to be ready for that. So it's, it's space, more space than you think you'll need to go slow. I think. Mental and physical hygiene, sleep and movement.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: And, and journaling. I think

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Oh, interesting. Journaling.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: saved me in some cases. Yeah, yeah. You know, just, just processing and just sort of being okay with where I was at with stuff.

Anyways, let me just pause because that though, I just, it's interesting, the contrast, right from being younger, losing first parent, a little second [00:30:00] parent knowing a little wiser in terms of some of my own practices and the journey I've been on. 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah. 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: What part of that list stands out for you? Because you've got the community and.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: yeah. Yeah. And I also have a coach as well, an executive coach, which is another fabulous, perquisite more than anything else that that was, was given to me when I took this role. And she's incredible. And I, I need sometimes somebody to just say, stop, just stop, pause, use the uncomfortable pause. Because I'm usually going 90 miles an hour and I, I did have a bit of a giggle when you, when you said, you know, the suck it up mentality.

I, I'm still so horribly. Horribly guilty of that. And, and if I could just share a little anecdote. One of the things in the school, and I think we had to actually postpone this because I had the opportunity to go on an outdoor education trip with our grade 10 class. Well, the week before I did that I fell and cracked a rib. [00:31:00] But I didn't want to admit it to anybody, so I still wanted to be able to go on this, on this trip. And they didn't, they didn't really tell me exactly what I'd be doing on the trip. So here I am with cracked rib. I'm trying not to laugh. I'm really trying not to sneeze, trying to be as healthy as possible.

And then I found out, first of all. I didn't look at the weather forecast when I agreed to this, so there was like a, what they called a cyclone bomb. So it's massive rainstorm up in the Strat cone of mountains in British Columbia on Vancouver Island. Plus I had to take these help take these grade 10 students.

Many of whom had never been out in the wilderness before on a canoeing trip, and none of them canoed before. So here I'm with my rib trying to steer a canoe and then trying to set up a tent on this island, and these kids are like, ah, bugs, outhouses. Ah. And I'm like, I, I couldn't wait until it got dark.

And then I was trying to get into my tent and I was like, moaning, like a dying moose. I was like, [00:32:00] oh, oh, oh. Trying to get down into my tent and, made it. It was an amazing trip. Like it really, really was incredible. But I got home and my husband's like, I just, I don't understand you sometimes. Like I just,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Well, and what, you know, it's funny because, oh, it's such a great example, but, you know, we'll push through and sort of power through.

I, my, my first coach ever when I first started working with him after I left corporate in 17 and. He said, yeah, you really like to effort through. Like, I would just like, just, and just kill myself in the process kind of thing.

 What's, what's kind of coming to mind though with the whole canoeing with a broken rib is the impact might have been, and I don't know if it was, it takes longer to heal. So with the contrast with Mom,

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yes.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: it took me at least four years to fully grieve her because. Because I didn't actively grieve because I was trying to push it down and get on with my [00:33:00] life and juggle all of the things right.

And, and there were a lot of things right. Dad came in to live with us. Like, like I just think about that period of time and I just think, how do I even do it? It's kind of breathless. And then with, with with dad though, I decided. I was going to actively grieve, not passively grieve, and so I still miss him every day and it's three years in, but I'm not, I would say it probably took me two years before I was.

You know, could talk about 'em without crying. So, you know, it, it, it's interesting. So that's, I cry. I change like I haved it, so to speak, you know,

because I think of a lot of really intentional practices around how to, how I dealt with it. I'm not saying I did perfectly, by the way. I'm just saying there was a lot of learning, a lot of experimenting that was helped.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: and I, and I think some little part of my reptilian brain is, is going Okay, you can't teach you, you can't. Cure the heart or the, the, [00:34:00] the soul of this impending loss just as easily as you're able to ignore a physical ailment, which is why I am really trying to be mindful about approaching this anticipatory grief and dealing with the family dynamics in a way that.

Is essentially practicing what I preach to my staff. Like I'm, I'm essentially trying to be my own, my own employee to some extent and say, okay, what would, what would I say to myself if, if I was sitting at this chair in my office and, and not able to go through this, well, this is what I would try and counsel somebody to do.

This is where I would direct them. So I'm, I'm really trying to be mindful about this whole scenario and also. You know, take the pause, like I said, like I, I, I, I need to slow down sometimes. And I don't think there's anything as as shocking as the idea of losing a parent to really make [00:35:00] you pause and reflect and just go, okay, this, this is my priority.

What is my priority?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: And you're not, we're not in control around Exactly. Yes. The, that's, that's what's, I think one of the most difficult things about grief, anticipatory, surprise. I mean, I.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: For those of us who, who just are so dynamic and we, you know, control is an illusion. And, and the sooner you recognize that, and for me it actually was a very, very dear friend of mine who who had lost her sister to, to breast cancer during the pandemic and didn't necessarily like, was, was really, really frustrated by some of the choices that her sister made, but ultimately came to, to the conclusion and, and shared it with me, which is.

It's not your choice, Leanne. Like you have no control over what's happening here, and all you get to do is support and love. That's, that's it.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: There's a real, and[00:36:00] 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: element to it. And I think the sooner that you surrender to it, because it's, it's a mental, it's a mental state. Grief is, it's a physical state. It's, it's really all consuming. So I, I think that, you know what I'm taking from you just, you know, you've got counseling, you've got coach, you've got a supportive community.

I, I, I don't recommend canoeing with a broken rib anymore.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Been there, done that. Not doing it again. Just say.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yeah. Well, you know, and, and here's something too that's, it makes me think of Viktor Frankl's men's search for Meaning, you know, and here's a, a Auschwitz survivor, you know, the interment camps. In Germany and seeing, you know, just the most horrible things around him.

He, he was, he was a prisoner and was skin and bones and was rescued and everything. But what he's written about, and I'm not gonna even paraphrase it probably, but just the essence is you know, we choose. We, we choose what we think about. And he chose [00:37:00] hope and he chooses to see what is the positive, even in the most dire of situations.

And that was dire. So it's this idea that, you know, as you, as you, you know, go through this really, really tough time, lean on with your mom, you're modeling the way for people. Around you when you take space, when you put boundaries around how much you're willing to take on or, or do, and when you talk about your experience.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah. Thank you. I, I appreciate that affirmation because that's really what I'm, I'm trying to do and trying to be both self-serving, but serving at the same time as, as I work my way through this. Yeah. And, and ultimately it does fill my bucket if I can, if I can achieve this balance and knowing again, that not everything is in my control, but if I can, if I can model something positive out of this really, really crappy experience, then I am doing a [00:38:00] service, you know?

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yeah, absolutely.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: So we're nearing the end of our, of our conversation. Something I did wanna mention just to recommend to you and listeners if, if, if listeners are, are also going through grief or anticipatory grief. It's a book that I found really helpful and it's called Grief One Day at a Time.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Okay.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: It's just like affirmations, like you just mentioned each day. And I found it very helpful, helpful in my journey to try to learn how to actively grieve. 

so That might be a great resource for you, for you and and

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: I'm gonna write that down as soon as we get offline.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Excellent. Well, thank you so much for being so, open-hearted and willing to share your experience with us for giving us a peek inside the independent school system but also into your personal experience as a, a woman.

You know, dealing with a lot of stuff right now, as many of us are.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Well, you know, I, I really do appreciate the opportunity [00:39:00] and it's not lost on me that my willingness to be open, but my experience with my employees has just magnified quite a bit by, by chatting with you.

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate1: Yes. You just ed it Absolutely. To all the listeners.

Yeah. that's. 

Leanne Schultz GMT20231012-201332_Recording_separate2: Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. But it feels right and it feels good and I wish everybody the space and the grace to deal with what they need to deal with.

Yeah. Okay. Thank you. [00:40:00]